Dark Souls

[fishbowlhead]

Well i finally did

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the minotor on the bridge boss, in the end i simply stood underneath him, blocked and wore him down, pretty simple and easy in the end

after that it was a whirlwind few hours really, got the summoning stone for co-op,

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some super powered white glowing Knight joined me straight away, we then went on to slaughter everything in sight right through the undead parish, did the gargoyle boss (the Knight killed it in one hit!), the Knight gave me every goodie in sight, what a lovely chap

[Golgo]

Cool, Fishbowlhead. Remember to do your jolly cooperation bit as well and help out a lower level player when you're a bit more powered up. I've done those gargoyles four times so far - haha! Easy souls, too.

[Golgo]

Just trudged down

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via the hollow to ash lake and killed that hydra, before hitting dead end with dragon covenant which I don't fancy the look of.

Picked up some nice loot on the way, but otherwise what a boring section! Compared to other areas it feels strangely unfinished. Ho hum, time to walk back now ...

[briareos_kerensky]

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Ash lake

is one of my favourite sections of Dark Souls' world.

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The giant hollowed trees you descend, the subtle music, the jumping hydra, the stretch of white sand cutting an endless sea of pristine water, the other trees in the background, the Dragon (oh, you can get a Greatsword if you cut his tail, it won't turn hostile or forbid you to join the Covenant)...

I find it beautiful. Getting there is a pain and getting back up is even more troublesome, but I really enjoy the place. Plus there you can get

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one the "best" endings for one of the NPCs

.

[losersclub]

Beat

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Smough & Ornstein

for the first time tonight. That has to be one of the most intense boss battles ever, very "epic"!

I got invaded whilst i was looking for a summon sign outside the fog gate as well, just ran to

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Solaire's

sign and went in with him rather than waiting for another human player. He was bloody useless though and died before the

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2nd Phase

Such a good game, has surpassed Demon's Souls now for me

[Golgo]

Fair point Briareos_Kerensky. I guess I was a bit grumpy because I expected some more fanfare after

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filling in the Hydra, rather than a dead end with a strangely furry mute dragon and a YES/NO Covenant option and a long walk back the way I came. I had his tail off, though. The walk along the beach

certainly offers a welcome change of pace, a bit like the descent

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into Darkroot basin

. I guess that's part of the purpose of those sections.

[Brad]

Lol, I never even visited

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Ash lake

. Damn.

[Golgo]

Clearly this is one of the games of the generation. I think it's the most coherent and cleverly structured gameworld I've ever played in. But two things are really bugging me.

1. (major gripe): the general opacity of fundamental game systems, in particular the interplay of the various 'covenants' in their online modes. Why accept to join a covenant when you are given no idea whatsoever what this entails? This isn't 'hardcore gamer's gaming' or whatever, it's just dumb. A little more explanation of what was at stake in leaving/joining this-or-that covenant would not make the game any less hardcore, but might in fact encourage people to engage more fully with the game's complexities. Reminds me of the light and dark affinities/world orientations of Demons. I don't accept the idea that you should undergo multiple playthroughs - or scour wikis - to try to tease out the workings of basic game systems. Weapon customization is another example of this. What is a 'Raw' upgrade? No idea. Not trying it/wasting precious resources as not even the blacksmiths can tell me.

2. (minor gripe): enemy pathfinding AI. More often than not enemies are happy to jam their faces into cavern walls, run lemming-like off ramparts, get snagged in bushes, or fire projectiles directly at a tree that you are standing safely behind. It's comical. The sound decoy spell is a great laugh for getting enemies to jump to their deaths. I wonder whether From haven't made the enemies so tough just to compensate for their stupidity.

In any other game, things like these would have made me chuck it. But Dark Souls is still so great in so many other ways that I'm now 50+ hours in and thoroughly enjoying it.

[hudson]

I like it because it does indeed feel like a game world. The paths are laid out in front of you. Your work is cut out for you. You are left with decisions. Which path? With slight Metroidvaniaisms i.e. Weapon choices, skill choices, back tracking etc. The combat, clunky, but tactical.

Please keep making these games, From Software.

[Brad]

Both games have many problems. Golgo highlighted the biggest one in that there is no way on earth to know what anything will do.

Hello Wanderer. I have been here for many lifetimes and seen many strange things, blah blah etc.

What is your answer?
YES or NO
WTF!? What is my answer? You didn't even ask a question!

I always answer YES in these situations. I do wonder though if that really is part of its charm, the uncertainty perhaps?

I'll keep buying these games for as long as From make them.

Played Demon's the other night. Feels very fast and 'light' compared to Dark Souls.

[briareos_kerensky]

IIRC weapon upgrades' details can be viewed before forging by pressing square.

Yeah, Covenants and some dialogues are very obscure and often yes/no questions feel very awkward, but I do prefer this rather than a dry list of benefits and do's/dont's. True, they could have been implemented better but they do fit the "do and learn" philosophy of the game.

[endo]

1. (major gripe): the general opacity of fundamental game systems, in particular the interplay of the various 'covenants' in their online modes.

I do agree with this to an extent. I've started playing this a lot again with the sole aim of finishing it now. Really enjoying it, but the lack of information does grate sometimes. It's not a lack of guidance as such and I do applaud the way the game basically chucks you in the deep end and expects you to just get on with it, but things like not showing how many souls you need to level up (I know that was fixed ages ago in a patch) are just stupid. That particular point was possibly an oversight seeing as they patched it, but things like that, as you say, are nothing to do with being a 'hardcore' game; it's just irritating.

The lack of info about weapons is odd too. Sure, you can trawl wikis or threads like this for information, but that's nothing to do with a hardcore game either. Considering some of the items you need for certain weapon power-ups are very hard to come by, it's unreasonable to expect the player to waste things trying out upgrades that may or may not be any good. That leads you to assume they want you to grind, which, again, is nothing to do with being hardcore; it's artificial difficulty and excessive grinding is purely the pursuit of the unemployed and anaemic Warcraft addicts.

But yeah, gripes aside, what a game. Whomped an invader for the first time the other day. In Blighttown no less, the prick, and I could see some dude running from quite far away over to where I was standing only for him to appear and then just dither like a tool, allowing me to kill him quite quickly. Cheered me right up that did.

[Golgo]

What to do with bosses' souls is another head-scratcher. I've got a few stashed and don't know whether to cash em in,

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feed em to that ugly f*** at Firelink

, or keep upgrading my weapons in the hope that one of these souls will help top one of them off into something special. Might just spend them I think as I'm not interested in hunting for best/special weapons for the achievements list.

Shameful admission: I did an invasion in Blighttown last night , but - in my defence - only because I was pissed off at something and wanted to try to ruin someone else's mood. Anyway, it didn't work. I was half dead with poison and fatigue by the time I waded through the swamp to the host and then I got royally filled-in. Spanking an invader is a great feeling, has to be said.

[hudson]

Can someone please remind me. How early on in the game can two people co-op play? Do you begin with White Sign Soapstone?

Also, how early on can two people do PvP in Prepar to Die Edition?

[endo]

I think you can summon without the white soapstone, but in order to be summoned yourself you need it. You get it fairly early on anyway, off

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Solaire

after the

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Taurus Demon

. Obviously you have to reverse hollowing for any of this.

Don't know about the Prepare to Die edition I'm afraid.