Nintendo Wii U

[dataDave]

Here's me thinking after 3DS quest/puzzle streetpass Nintendo could have improved the Achievement experience.

They have improved the Achievement Experience by omitting it entirely.

Developers should go back to including their own achievements in-game. Complete on Normal Mode to unlock new outfits/characters. Complete on Hard Mode to unlock a secret level and extended ending.. etc etc.

For leader boards on racing games (such as F-Zero) you should be able to unlock a silver version of your craft if you can hold a top 10 spot on any track for two weeks, manage a #1 spot for four weeks and you unlock a golden version of your craft. How good would that be?

So simple to implement, but these days, these true 'achievements' have been converted into DLC which we have to pay more money for, and a great deal of gamers prefer a totally pointless score and badge system in it's place, which I find depressing. Really depressing, actually.

Dave - I still actually marvel at your ability to do F-Zero GX on very hard, considering I tried forever and couldn't do it. I only know this because you mentioned it on here. Why not have a little badge on your profile that tells me this?

I don't care, I'll just enjoy the fact that I had all the arcade craft/tracks, and you didn't Even better if the game had online functionality, and then I could have shown them off.

Believe me, that was one of the most rewarding experiences I can remember. If that game came out now people would just be able to pay a fiver for the extras and just skip the achievements if they were too hard. :/

[JSR]

I mean its something and nothing really, but it wouldnt be difficult to implement, and many gamers have voiced a desire for the feature...so the question for me is why the hell not?

Because it's an arbitrary reward that replaces the drive for experimentation and exploration in a game and reduces the conceivable, self-imposed challenges within it to pointless, menial tasks measured in hollow numbers. Almost like how midichlorians were meant to measure force strength in Star Wars. Back in the day, playing a game was its own reward. I didn't need to be rewarded for dicking around. Didn't need a pre-set goal to make me try to make a car pile-up in GTA. I did it because it was fun. And even when I had completed a game, I didn't feel "done" with it because I had accumulated all the possible achievements or trophies; I kept playing it until I didn't feel like playing it anymore. And I for one is very happy to see Nintendo shy away from shallow trends introduced to satiate the modern need for instant gratification.

[Family Fry]

When I said Nintendo could have improved it you go on to say
"They have improved the Achievement Experience by omitting it entirely."
BUT then in the same reply say
"Developers should go back to including their own achievements in-game. Complete on Normal Mode to unlock new outfits/characters. Complete on Hard Mode to unlock a secret level and extended ending.. etc etc."

NINTENDO COULD HAVE DONE THIS IF THEY HAD A GO AT IMPROVING THE EXPERIENCE.

Just think the 3DS Streetpass experience of unlocking coins to buy little puzzle pieces and wandering in a quest mode with people you have met, now pictures this on Wii U with you having to do specific things in games (achievements) to unlock content which you are rewarded for instead of numbers/trophies/levels, there we go instantly a better system and Nintendo could have done this.
When I heard about Wii U I thought Nintendo would have taken some ideas from competitors and basically Nintendofied them with their charm and design, something that they do very well. Also every other company on earth seems to be jumping onto the achievement bandwagon so why not make it better and more fun on a Nintendo console?
Instead they have indeed Nintendofied them by not including them at all, pretty much what I should have expected Nintendo to do all along.

[PaTaito]

Cancelled my pre-order, the big first party title is one of my least favorite wii games, and most of the others are already out.

Will pick this up when its more like ?179.99. That proved to be a sweet spot when wii released and people couldnt get enough of it.

Just cannot justify ?320 for the machine + zombiu.

[PaTaito]

Because it's an arbitrary reward that replaces the drive for experimentation and exploration in a game and reduces the conceivable, self-imposed challenges within it to pointless, menial tasks measured in hollow numbers. Almost like how midichlorians were meant to measure force strength in Star Wars. Back in the day, playing a game was its own reward. I didn't need to be rewarded for dicking around. Didn't need a pre-set goal to make me try to make a car pile-up in GTA. I did it because it was fun. And even when I had completed a game, I didn't feel "done" with it because I had accumulated all the possible achievements or trophies; I kept playing it until I didn't feel like playing it anymore. And I for one is very happy to see Nintendo shy away from shallow trends introduced to satiate the modern need for instant gratification.

Whats that got to do with the fact that its

A, Easily implemented

B, In demand by many folks

C, Doesnt have any effect on people like yourself who play the game and dont give a damn about achievements.

I understand that some people are not bothered with achievements, but voicing against it is just pointless hot air in the large scheme of things. There is demand for such a function and its nintendo doing what they always have, and always will do.

To be indifferent is fine, but how can anybody be against such a thing?...if you dont care for it then it means nothing either way.

On a personal note trying to push for 1000g has made me discover really cool parts of a couple of games i would have otherwise quit after flying through on normal mode. Case in point zombies mode in COD blops....i had a quick blast to try and finish off the last remaining achievements after completing the game on veteran, and had i not had those extra few achievements to give me that extra motivation, i never would have discovered the wonders of zombies mode. Funnily enough that was the first time i bothered to try for 1000g just because i did veteran and was almost there.

But i can think of many cases where people have probably stuck out at a particular game thanks to the achievements system, and become so much more engrossed thanks to these objectives. Like if you are new to street fighter 4, and the drive for training achievements make you a better fighter, and thus improve the fighting game community as the result of pushing for people to learn properly.

Of course not all of them have a positive spin, but they are harmless and people seem to like them generally.

Overall i'm not pro achievements and have only 1000g'd two games, but i hate it when people actively stand against it, or pointlessly defend nintendo's backward view on the matter.

[dataDave]

When I said Nintendo could have improved it you go on to say
"They have improved the Achievement Experience by omitting it entirely."
BUT then in the same reply say
"Developers should go back to including their own achievements in-game. Complete on Normal Mode to unlock new outfits/characters. Complete on Hard Mode to unlock a secret level and extended ending.. etc etc."

NINTENDO COULD HAVE DONE THIS IF THEY HAD A GO AT IMPROVING THE EXPERIENCE.

Just think the 3DS Streetpass experience of unlocking coins to buy little puzzle pieces and wandering in a quest mode with people you have met, now pictures this on Wii U with you having to do specific things in games (achievements) to unlock content which you are rewarded for instead of numbers/trophies/levels, there we go instantly a better system and Nintendo could have done this.
When I heard about Wii U I thought Nintendo would have taken some ideas from competitors and basically Nintendofied them with their charm and design, something that they do very well. Also every other company on earth seems to be jumping onto the achievement bandwagon so why not make it better and more fun on a Nintendo console?
Instead they have indeed Nintendofied them by not including them at all, pretty much what I should have expected Nintendo to do all along.

That's almost what I meant. I'm confused.

F-Zero GX worked with a score/currency system ON TOP of having to unlock stuff. You play, you save points. You play well, you unlock store items to purchase with said accumulated points. On top of all this I don't need a badge telling me I've done it. It's pointless.

Nintendo could be doing that what you say. It's just that it doesn't come in a universally glorified accumulation, and therefore hasn't been advertised. Achievements didn't exist when F-Zero GX was dishing out rewards for dedicated play. They are achievements, they just aren't labelled as such. These kind of implementations are left at the discretion of the developer.

C, Doesnt have any effect on people like yourself who play the game and dont give a damn about achievements.

It does affect us in the long run, developers have increasingly been dishing out gamer points for rewards whilst holding back all the good **** as DLC. What is most of today's smaller-scale DLC would have been unlockable content back in the day. Unlockable by achieving certain feats. I'm done with Capcom for this very reason (That and they aren't quite as good as they used to be).

[dataDave]

Saying all this I'm not avoiding the fact that Nintendo will likely jump on the DLC money train.

[PaTaito]

It does affect us in the long run, developers have increasingly been dishing out gamer points for rewards whilst holding back all the good **** as DLC.

What is most of today's smaller-scale DLC would have been unlockable content back in the day. Unlockable by achieving certain feats.

I'm done with Capcom for this very reason (That and they aren't quite as good as they used to be).

DLC has nothing to do with achievements, and everything to do with money.

Also loads of games unlock items when you hit certain achievements...so that excuse has no legs.

Console DLC started when achievements didnt even exist. It proved popular and made money, and the rest is history.

[arcnas]

Im tempted to cancel my WII u Zombie pack , but im going to wait until the reviews come out this week in the states, if they are all positive i wont cancel i think..

[djtickle]

F-Zero GX worked with a score/currency system ON TOP of having to unlock stuff. You play, you save points. You play well, you unlock store items to purchase with said accumulated points. On top of all this I don't need a badge telling me I've done it. It's pointless.

I totally agree that some games work well, especially if they have integrated scoreboards. If a game pushes you to unlock stuff then all the better. As for having a badge telling you that you have done it I dont think its pointless at all look at Halo or Black OPs II this week, I completed them both on the hardest setting and 1st thing I did was flick to my friends lists to see if I was the 1st to do it. (We have been bantering on text all week about it). Its nice for sharing player to player progression if anything if you ask me.

I cant see games having public scoreboards for a lot of this stuff, just taking halo 4 again for example.

Ledge completion
Completing Mission 6 with all 6 cpu mercs alive on heroic or harder
Completing Ep2 Mission 3 of OPs with at least 1 cpu merc alive on heroic or harder

I've been doing these with BD members, and this is bringing new life to the game which apart from Ledge completion I most likely would not have bothered with and we have had a good laugh to boot. Not to mention the social aspects of doing this.

[ItsThere]

Lolwhut?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-15-basic-8gb-wii-u-has-just-3gb-space-after-system-installs

That is worse than Apple.

[teddymeow]

Lolwhut?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-15-basic-8gb-wii-u-has-just-3gb-space-after-system-installs

That is worse than Apple.

I was just about to post this too.

Buying the basic set? You're getting mugged off, son.

I still want one after watching the WaraWara Plaza video but the inability of the thing to upscale Wii games is a pain in the ass.

[gambit6613]

In fairness to Nintendo this is not that different to the 4GB Xbox or the 12GB PS3, this basic pack is aimed at people who are just happy enough to play Nintendoland and the like and dont intend to be downloading stuff. At the end of the day most main gamers will be buying the premium pack anyway. Even if you do require more space hardrives a pretty cheap nowdays.

[ItsThere]

Remember that you can only use a hard drive that has an external power source.

For me this is untidy.

[ETC]

Remember that you can only use a hard drive that has an external power source.

For me this is untidy.

For me it says they scrimped on the usb's